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I'm online checking for models online seeing if maybe on e-bay I can pick up some models that my local shop doesn't sell. I go on and see jets for well over $90+ and my jaw drops. I understand some jets are rare and hard to come by. But what is with people online posting a 1:400 757 model for $99??? So my question is do people actually pay these prices? I would never in a million years spend as much for one 1:400 scale jet the same price as I can buy four of them. And also what accuracy are the prices on our database for models? Because clearly there is a big price difference between the value of a plane and what people actually sell it for.
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Cloud Services Admin/Collector since 2006 -
--Some of the prices in my view are very optimistic indeed if one views it objectively.
Unfortunately that is the 'dark side' of how capatalism works. Supply and demand.
If you have something which was made in 'limited numbers' and there are someone out there who really, REALLY, wants it, then you can set your price whatever you want to make a tidy profit.
I started collecting quite recently and there were (and are) some items which are not readily available. For my SAA fleet there were a couple for which I definatly over-paid and I do feel that I was done in, but it was the only way I could get that particular model. It does leave a bad taste in the mouth and one does feel a bit resentful at the seller because it really isn't worth that much if one considers that it is just a piece of metal with some fancy printing on it.
So, those models on e-bay for that 'ridiculous' price might one day be sold when someone who really wants it becomes fearful that it might never become available again and decides to part with their cash.
In my view I blame the manufacturers with their 'limited realeases'. They create the FOMO (fear of missing out) hype and people scramble to buy the few examples available.
In the short term it brings in the cash, but in the long term I think it harms the hobby as it becomes too difficult for new entrants (fleet builders) to get into the hobby and some people will just give up. I already see an 'exclusive club' of collectors who think of themselves as in a different club than others.
Some collectors have deep pockets and can afford to order the pre-releases and then later sell them at a bit of a profit. I do also realise not all buyers are of this sort and there are some bargains to get out there too, but it becomes more and more difficult as time goes on.
As to the accuracy of the database prices.... I don't put any stock into it. I view it as a rough guideline of what some might have paid for it.-
awwe, i was hoping to see your response to what/ who are the 'exclusive club' members. -
Dear Fleetlord, you have been collecting long enough and been active here and on the other forum for long enough to know.
There are several unofficial 'clubs'. And I don't use the term 'club' as meaning a club where you pay dues etc., I use it in the sense of belonging to a group of people.
Now to unpack:
Her is a grumpy old man's list of types of posters (groups/clubs): Hope you enjoy.
One group rates themselves higher than other collectors because they are of the lucky few to have one of the 'limited releases'.
I've seen plenty of threads (not here) where people post 'wanted' models. Then these people come on to 'gloat' that they have that particular model, but that they are not parting with it. What is the use of that other than to seem to be gloating. It doesn't help at all and it seems to be rather patronizing to say the least.
Then there are those who knows a certain model is going to be wanted by a lot of people. (For instance an Inflight KLM release. Personally I don't see why KLM is such a sought after livery, but that is just me). There are some which will buy two of those in order to make a tidy profit a couple of years down the line when they sell the 'spare' for double what they paid for. Thereby they got the one they keep for free. Now I understand that in a free market system this is what you can do, but personally I feel that is exploiting your wealth to the detriment of others less fortunate. Who can afford to buy two IF200 models of the same plane?
Then there is the group who seems to have enough money to buy almost every single release which comes out. Then when someone else posts a model they recently obtained, these one's come on and post that they also have that particular model, but then add that they have the other 20 or so releases of that airline as well. And well, you don't have them, so you are in a different class.
I have even seen this type comment when someone posts their fleet as saying.... "What a nice little fleet you have there". It is totally condescending. Why not just congratulate the person on their fleet.
Then there are the Forum Gods. You know, those guys who have been around since forums were invented. Because they have been a member since then, their posts should carry more weight as they are the 'elders'.
There is also the perception amongst some that you need to have a certain number of posts before you can be taken seriously. Which does not make any sense whatsoever to me. You can have a million posts and still talk rubbish.
I also see (especially on the other forum) that there seems to be a group which are pretty much allied to a certain member. No matter what that member posts they are always supporting that member, no matter the validity of any counter argument. They do seem to be friends who enjoys frequent visits as well and I am sure that there are some 'advantages' to that. A kind of posse it seems to me sometimes.
If I sit and thing some more, I can possibly come up with some more examples. :-)
Remember, this is only my view.
Hope you had a few good laughs. :-) -
I understood it was not the fee paying kind, here we call them "clicks" as well as clubs. I have noticed the clicks when i first started & had my first hand exp w/ "group which are pretty much allied to a certain member." & the "the Forum Gods". The one where people have illogical allegiance to a member is the one i was blindsided by! robertjon5 posted angrily about a seller selling a model before robertjon5 was able to answer his email. a few months later he offered me a model & sold it before i could respond on a St Patricks day weekend!! So I commented how he was a hypocrite. From nowhere TOGAselected attacks me & then N. Eberhard; both told me i was acting badly!! N. Eberhard actions made no sense in any universe as he is a home base retailer. He told me to also add him to my ignore list, the only reason i could think of was his "friendship" to robertjon5...i was stupefied, this was classic grade school shenanigans. N. Eberhard actions were especially irrational, several days later i tried to order a couple of models from his store & nothing, no rejection email, no explanation, nothing. In essence he banned from doing business with him w/o informing me of such ban!?! (very passive aggressive)
Many months later i realized of the business he missed out because of his behavior, so instead of staying above their level & not acting in spite i lowered myself to N. Eberhard level & posted a thread of how much i spent during the holidays...not my best moment by anyone's definition, but it sure felt GOOD!!!Last edited by fleetlordatvar; 02-27-2014, 12:46 AM.
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Originally posted by eugenevh View Post
Ditto about any DB, it's only a reference especially since they deal w/ averages. As for deep pockets, it's more likely that have deep credit lines & are in the same level debt as the typical consumer average anywhere in the world per the country they live in.
ok now for the gossip, what "exclusive club" exist? What is the criteria for them e.g. snobby/ belittling comments or are they in the "biz"?
It's a misconception to blame the manufactures because they have no marketing tools that are reliable enough to predict demand. Notice how many of the infamous Skyline Laker Airlines even w/ the Skltrain livery that are still available; dirt cheap? You can make the argument after a specific model has sold well or known to be popular, but there are other cost/ business factors than pure profit that will override the decision to produce more of those that sold well. People most certainly can't call it the dark side of capitalism, but it's the most expensive! It's called the dark side because of the emotional response to seeing the price hurdle to getting the expensive model.
There is also a major silver linning that is being overlooked, the models being produced in the last ~7 years are massive improvements over what was being profduced before, i saw pics of an IMC produced planes & they look like woosters/ flight miniatures!! IMC was a company & renowned for quality, but it doesn't hope up to what's available now. So you, I & others who are late into the collecting did miss out on some gems, but we also didn't get stuck w/ poor quality models of yesterday.
FireAngelZero,
the short answer is yes people do buy some of them at those ridiculous prices.
I had hooters two plane set, i was ready to list @ $40, but at the last minute i did a search & found the exact same thing listed for $120
My reaction was iiconyo!! No one is going to buy it @ that price
A few seconds later & reviewing the info to verify i had the exact same thing (still couldn't believe someone would ever pay that price) for s#its & giggles i listed mine for $100
Less than 36hrs later someone emailed me & asked if i could wait until he got paid on the 1st of the month which was ~10 days later. I had nothing to loose so i said sure (his eBay fb was great) Sure enough on the 1st he paid
I did the same thing w/ the pepsi & coke A380s, i checked before i listed & they were listed @ $120, so i listed mine @ $99; the two Pepsi's at the time sold & one of them wasn't even mint w/ glue residue on the bottom of the wing & wing strut!
Now i re- listed the coke one for $99 again. Someone would have already bought it a month ago, but when i inspected it i was missing the stand, which i've now found.
I've also been guilty of over paying for a model, but that is due to my lack of restraint...something I'm still working on & being tested as waffle has just listed another BLOWOUT sale...so far i've talked myself down to six models from 11
btw, the highest i sold a model for was $120 for one Cathay Pacific B747!Last edited by fleetlordatvar; 02-21-2014, 10:34 PM.--Comment
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Very interesting thread.. I suspect some of these guys on eBay are not in a hurry to sell unless the price is right. Once I did this with a couple of models I'm lukewarm about, just to test the market. They didn't sell of course, and neither do most of the overpriced listings.
For example I recently searched eBay for a 1/400 GJ UPS 757, since I remembered seeing one last year go for $20 including shipping. There were several close to $50 w/ zero bids on them. I don't know what happened in the interim to cause this spike. The model is still available at several retailers.
I'm fond of saying I lose 9/10 auctions on eBay, because I refuse to overpay. And if I really want something I prefer to go with an established retailer.
Just my .02
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**remember to type 1/400, then select worldwide & sold options & finally choose highest + shipping when you do a search & you'll see that some do sell with no problems; The results are for the last three months.
Check out some of the absurd prices some people paid
- Diecast & Toy Vehicles 20 / 50 highest selling 1/400 listings sold were for a single 1/400 plane which sold for >$132
- Aviation 164 / 200 highest selling 1/400 listings sold were for a single 1/400 plane which sold for >$104.99
**CORRECTION my Mint PEPSI A380 sold for $105.99 w/ free ship & had 4 bids/ two bidders
**OMG, the hooter plane set i used as an example, it sold for 125 + shipping
I should have held out for more
; http://www.ebay.com/itm/Gemini-Jets-...p2047675.l2557
Last edited by fleetlordatvar; 02-21-2014, 12:35 AM.--Comment
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what do you guys think, did the info from eBay change anyone's perception of how often they sell & what forsaken prices someone paid?
FireAngelZero
How about $900+ for a plastic 1/200
http://www.ebay.com/itm/HERPA-Premim...item27df119225
Last edited by fleetlordatvar; 02-21-2014, 11:47 AM.--Comment
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--Originally posted by eugenevh View Post
Speaking of ridiculous prices, what is your opinion on the SM200 models you bought. They have decals & wonder what your impressions are, i have a couple, but wanted to learn what you think of them.
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I am happy with them.
If one looks very close at them then you can see that decals have been used. The further away you go the less noticeable it becomes.
I don't look at my models through macro photography or with magnifying glasses, so for me they are more than acceptable.
Considering they are individually decaled, then the price is not too bad compared to tampo printed models.
Also keeping in mind that they are of liveries which will unlikely ever be mass-made by other manufacturers, then they are really worth the cost (for me).
I will be looking to get more in future as you can see from my wishlist, I just hope that there will be enough for when I do get the funds.
My only concern is that the decals would yellow over time. Even with indirect sunlight and some artificial lighting also do send out UV light which could yellow the decals over time.
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